In my experience it has mainly been people posting about why Biden deserves to lose the presidency and then flipping it to “Chill bro it’s just the primary” when challenged.
Deserves’ got nothin to do with it.
Biden is going to lose the presidency if he doesn’t address the obvious flaws in his election campaign. Protest votes in the primary are just that, protest votes. They’re trying to send a message to the president that they are democrats, they aren’t supporting another candidate, but they have serious (and in my opinion legitimate) concerns.
The number of political pundits and armchair campaign managers shouting about how those protest votes help Trump is ridiculous. That’s what this meme is referencing.
Biden needs to win in Michigan. He needs to carry Virginia and Ohio and Wisconsin. Georgia would be a boon, but I don’t want to need it. Right now, Trump is even or ahead in all of those states, and nobody can fix that except Biden.
Edit to add a link for anyone who doesn’t think it exists.
Die hard Isreal supporters WILL vote for trump instead of biden. They are single issue voters. Anyone not voting for biden over failure to support Palestine is a full fledged idiot to support trump instead. Just stop repeating this bullshit already.
Did you reply to the wrong person? Nothing you said was relevant to what I said.
I get the frustration and I, too, agree with the criticism being thrown at Biden. I just suppose I don’t see how people object to the idea of voting for the lesser of two evils when the consequence is the greater of two evils retaking power.
I have to believe most people making those types of arguments are either single-issue voters who think Trump will be better for Palestine, or they are not members of vulnerable classes (e.g. immigrants, women, LGBTQ+, non-Christians, racial minority groups) whose rights would be imperiled by a Trump presidency, and therefore have nothing to lose.
Edit: Wow this was holding positive yesterday and now we’re at -10. Guess the downvote trolls were out in full force while the US slept.
I just suppose I don’t see how people object to the idea of voting for the lesser of two evils when the consequence is the greater of two evils retaking power.
Because he’ll lose! That’s the objection. It’s a losing strategy. Trump is the greater evil, and he’s winning because Biden is not doing enough to win votes. People had a reason to vote against Trump four years ago, but now they have reasons to vote against Biden. Anybody willing to vote for Trump is not a reasonable person, but far too many reasonable people won’t bother to show up because they don’t have a reason to vote for Biden.
I agree with everything else you said.
Polls basically don’t mean shit. The suggestion that Trump is winning is completely nonsensical.
I don’t think you’re wrong to think one poll in isolation is not very valuable. But they are the only predictive measure we have, and they have consistently placed Trump ahead in critical swing states.
Now maybe they are all completely wrong. But I think keeping Trump out of power is too important to just ignore all the information we have right now.
I’ll happily come back here and donate $100 to a charity of your choosing if it turns out you’re right and the polls were way off, and Biden wins every swing state in a landslide. I would love to be wrong.
he’s winning because Biden is not doing enough to win votes.
far too many reasonable people won’t bother to show up because they don’t have a reason to vote for Biden.
That’s the part I am hung up on, I guess. Anyone who has the power to prevent another Trump presidency but isn’t willing to show up in November to do so is not a reasonable person.
If Gaza is the only thing preventing would-be Biden voters from voting in November, these are people who must otherwise not give a shit about LGBTQ+ people, about immigrants, about bodily autonomy, or about the separation of church and state.
So if the Pro-Palestine crowd feels comfortable throwing in their cards with Trump, essentially allying with the Pro-Israel crowd who are also beginning to move away from supporting Democrats in general by some ass-backwards line of reasoning, then they’re every bit as bad as any other MAGA conservative in my book.
Thats why all the threads on the Michigan uncommitted campaign are completely empty of libs saying that voting uncommitted in a primary is helping Trump. /s
My experience is people saying Biden shouldn’t win the presidency and I tell them they should express their dissatisfaction in the primary instead of giving the presidency to Trump and then they’re like “no, primaries are meaningless”.
In this case the primary is meaningless, there is no chance of an incumbent president not being the nominee. Even in the New Hampshire ballot where Biden wasn’t even a named candidate, he still won as a write-in.
I won’t judge anyone for voting however they want in the primary, at least, and I think it’s dumb if you do. I’ve voted for candidates who dropped out in the past just to express my displeasure at the de facto nominee.
The uncommitted campaign seems to have them frazzled, they wouldn’t have establishment Dems telling people that the uncommitted campaign helps trump if it had no effect at all. They are watching, it rattles their confidence, and seems to have at least some amount of impact on policy, and I don’t see a downside.
It’s classic motte-and-bailey technique
I had no idea there was even a name for that, thank you for the info!
Also, per the usual, shits posted in the wee hrs of the murican morn, just like all the other shitty russian propaganda that gets posted on lemmy. They post this just as americans are getting up and use their spam accounts to quickly inflate the vote total before anyone with more than 15 functioning braincells catches on and calls em out on it. Ive been noticing more ppl on lemmy calling this BS out recently. Sometimes the internet still gives me hope in humanity.
Midnight in Los Angeles? Yes, comrade. You figured me out!
Yeah people really think that and you’re totally not making shit up right now
Well, I literally had to explain how different states have different rules for their primaries. Some are open and anyone can vote and others only allow registered R or D to vote in their respective primaries (or caucus or whatever).
I’m not sure what your experience is when talking details of the US election system to people who only vote during the presidential election, but most people aren’t well informed. They are too busy working to make ends meet and the system puts extra steps so people get confused or tired and stop looking into it.
I had to explain to a co-worker that they can vote for whatever they want and it’s ok to leave some blank if they’re unsure. She thought her entire ballot didn’t count if she left some of the measures blank. So she never voted because “there’s too many things to research”.
Years ago I had to explain to my own mother, that registering for a party doesnt dictate your vote. She thought if she signed up as a Democrat she would only be able to vote for Democrats.
Well that is something. It’s almost like they don’t teach us how to vote, or organize, or be civil servants for a reason.
Do you seriously believe what you wrote here? You think most Americans understand how primaries work? That’s fascinating.
I can’t tell if ignorance is bliss, or if you’re just optimistic
A specific claim was made that would shock me if it’s true of 40% of Americans and yes I realize Americans are dumber than average. Posting that here as though it’s a common thing is bullshit. It’s just op trying to act like their pro trump agenda is something else.
deleted by creator
It’s called a strawman. What I actually have to explain to people is that they should express their dissatisfaction in the primary instead of not voting in the general.
You say that like no new generation to the game ever called the candidates irrelevant white male boomers as an excuse why they don’t vote. And when I say vote, they aren’t talking primaries.
deleted by creator
Righteousness is not preventing it either. You could take your own advice there.
No… Seriously… Is this an actual thing? The whole world knows about how the American voting system works (or doesn’t ) and you have Americans who don’t?
This actually makes way more sense than expected
The whole world knows about how the American voting system works
No we don’t. We just understand that you have some form of FPTP. Minutiae like primaries and stuff isn’t known about.
A lot of people are ignorant of the whole entire process. This is not an accident. If you educate your voter base, they might vote against you.
deleted by creator
One of them seems to be the Michigan governor, even.
(See her criticism of the “Listen to Michigan” campaign.)
They know how it works. They just want progressives’ eternal silence.
It’s not. OP is mostly anti-Biden spam. Posting stuff like this is to obfuscate their intent. Make it seem like other people just don’t get what they’re saying.
No it doesn’t. I’m pretty interested in politics so I understand some of it
- your parties vote for who they’re going to have to run for them. The details of this I don’t know.
- you have state by state FPTP elections. The details of this I don’t know.
- some weird shit happens with something called the
electricalelectoral college. - somehow Congress and the house of representatives are elected.
the electoral college is only for the president, the rest is pretty on point. the only “national” election is when the electoral college votes (we don’t vote for the president directly, we vote for how we want our state’s electors to vote), and the rest is left up to the states (who love to make as huge a mess as they can of it), which is why the details seem obfuscated.
Is it that different states have different amounts of electors based on population?
If you’re pretty interested in politics you should learn how it works. I’m not interested in politics, but fully understand how they work.
And yea it is a weird and convoluted system, but it’s really not that complex or confusing.
I understand how the system of the country I live in works. I was responding to the comment that everyone in other countries understands how the system works in the USA.
I’m an American who has paid attention to and participated in politics for over 20 years and I still get confused, our method of electing leaders is seriously WTF.
Lol no. Even the most disastrous military run regimes have multiple parties and dedicated seats for minorities.
Case in point: Pakistan
Everyone else looks at the American voting system like some haunted house with our dual parties, confusing electoral college for congress, first past the goal system, national polls vs gerrymandered zones, and that one time the SC somehow got to decide elections.
Oh and election day is still not a national holiday lmao.
I can easily count the number of people that I know who understand the electoral college.
Anyway, I’m not sure about the users here, but Whitmer literally just whined about people voting uncommitted in the primary because it was bad publicity for Biden. Like yeah, no shit that’s the point. We’re voicing our disapproval in poll that has nothing to do with the actual elections.
Think that is bad? Now try Americans understanding our own tax system.
I have grown ass adults routinely demonstrate they don’t understand tax brackets as recently as last year during our union contract negotiations. Motherfuckers arguing against raises because they think the next tax bracket will make them lose money.
So yeah, people thinking Biden criticism is Trump support is fairly commonplace.
Even liberals are getting fed up with Biden’s shit.
He should take note.
U done fucked up when even Ezra Klein tells you to go.
I primary when there’s someone worth primarying for.
That means at minimum someone who is actually in favor of social and economic equity in the policies they support. Things like UBI, returning taxes to pre-reagan levels, wealth taxes (oh you have to sell some shares to pay the tax so corporate ownership is more widely dispersed in society? The horror!), prioritizing education funding and fixing our public schools rather than selling out the last paltry funding it has to the wall street charter school Trojan horse, bailing out people in difficult times from the bottom up, and actually enforcing tax code from the top earners down, as the winners should pay back to improve the society that facilitated their wealth hoarding in the first place.
I’ll show up for Biden and vote for him in the general with a shuffle in my step and a funeral dirge in my heart, same as for Biden last time and Clinton before that.
I am here once again to vote for least worst, not because I have any hope for a better future, but so I can sleep at night using what little power I have for harm reduction, for keeping the water pumps on the Titanic running, still full well knowing the ship will still sink regardless, just a little slower, and people will die without real help arriving.
I do the chore of picking least worst every time in the general. If I cant even actually get to vote for something positive, even in the primary, then wake me in November for my chore.
I’d love to see some examples of this level of stupidity, have not encountered it in the wild.
Have met plenty of “MAKE THE BIDEN MAN APOLOGIZE TO PALESTINE OR HE’LL NEVER GET MY VOTE” types… sincerely hope their urges to ‘show’ them dems doesn’t end up with them put into camps and deported. or worse.
Here’s an example…
wow.
well, I stand corrected, there’s all levels of stupidity to be found. ty for the link.
The straw-est of mans. The argument is that Trump will win the General if you don’t vote for Biden in the General. Nobody cares what you do in the primary.
The Biden surrogates online called the Michigan uncommitted voters terrorists so…
Isn’t the point of voting Uncommitted to send a message, to provoke a response?
I’m not saying they shouldn’t have. By all means apply some pressure, but when doing so recognize that there will be a reaction. Not following up with that with additional pressure, or an organized follow through turns what could have been real pressure into windbaggery.
No offense to you in particular, but this kind of response comes off as defensive and kinda whiny.
So, who are you a surrogate for? You agenda post all day.
I’m a surrogate for no one. I just like to remind Dems their idols are faux.
deleted by creator
The GOP is unsalvageable. Trump is an idiot. The Dems are the only other choice to try to move Left. Biden’s currently moving right.
deleted by creator
But he has? He’s literally trying to out-flank the GOP by moving to the right on immigration and the border wall. Which will not only fail to persuade trumpers to move dem, but will dissuade pro-immigration liberals and progressives. It’s a bad move. I think the rationale is that those crowds will have to vote Biden anyway or be stuck under fascist trump. Instead of trying to inch closer to Trump on Policy, Biden should try to distance himself from the GOP and run on popular progressive positions like Universal Healthcare, Public Infrastructure, increasing minimum wage, etc. And also stopping military and international support for Israel’s genocide in Gaza. Make more people enthusiastic about voting for Biden.
This comment reminds me of something:
What republicans could they remind on lemmy? There are none and if there were most instances would (and have, exploding heads iirc) defed from theirs. Tbf, you don’t know whether or not they have an acct on truthsocial or even explodingheads and post inflammatory memes to them there where any of them would actually see it. Any “reminding” of republicans happening here is nothing more than a circle jerk everyone already agrees with, it’s just “preaching to the saved,” to steal an expression from religion, and unless you’re passing around a collection plate in the next few minutes preaching to the saved benefits exactly nothing.
deleted by creator
Where exactly are people saying not to vote in the general? All I’m seeing is/were calls to vote undecided in the Michigan primary
I was referring to specifically this
deleted by creator
Yea, its not like the Biden campaign asked Gretchen Whitmer to say exactly that voting uncommitted in the primary would be helping Trump in the general.
Once again, perpetual short-term thinking while looking both backwards and forwards is the order of the day, and not just the “liberals” mentioned in the meme, also those who would let the orange turd stink up the White House while actively selling your children’s future to the highest kickbacks bidder over at Mierda-Lago.
It’s just a ploy by the non voters so they can later complain as if their hands were tied about the candidates being too old as if other candidates were never an option.
Prepare for this is the lead up to the ’I won’t vote for two geriatrics. They don’t represent my generation’ bullshit.
I don’t even live in the country and I understand the primaries better than the average opinionated American and this makes me sad.
You actually think primarying Biden will give the DNC a better chance of winning?
Thank you for this shining example of incompetency of progressives in politics. You would rather spite your base and let a fascist in because he’s not perfect for you. 👏👏👏
