Except we all know this is not done in good faith to fix a real problem. Its real intent to further push a transphobic agenda and punish people who are trans.
Would agree, except 99% of person identification, uses sex and specifically YOUR birth certificate. For current identification purposes for anything official.
Of course I have. I can’t recall when I got my first license at 16 years old, but I certainly haven’t needed it since then. The most I’ve ever been asked for, including by employers, is my social security card
I fail to see the major problem, then. It’s easily rectified by getting two other easily obtained id’s. You don’t even need a driver’s license, an identification card is basically the same process.
However, because all other records take information from your birth certificate, this effectively bars trans people from having photo identification that aligns with their gender. This creates a safety issue for trans people every time they have to provide said photo identification.
Your birth certificate also records the name your parents gave you at birth, but we’ve allowed people to amend the document when they change their name for a long time. Why is this any different?
Plenty of folks don’t know. There are experts that are brought in to determine confusing cases, and they sometimes get it wrong. Be happy if your genitals just match one of the obvious binaries and you don’t have this issue. But many folks do.
The purpose of the document is to record facts but you’re ok if those facts are wrong sometimes. That seems strange to me.
Why does the document event need a gender or sex? We’re recording that a person was born for proof of citizenship. Citizenship doesn’t require genitalia.
We’re recording for a number of reasons which includes birth of citizenship. There are important demographic reasons for why you need to know what % of your population is male versus female.
For example, policy in China where there are a larger ratio of males would need to be different than in Russia where there is a higher ratio of females.
I don’t really see the issue in all of this. A trans person should be treated as whatever gender they wanna be but they are born one sex or the other. We can’t pretend otherwise, makes no sense.
Sex. Isn’t. Binary. Intersex people exist. They exist. They are real.
I’d agree with you if there were three options: obviously male, obviously female, TBD. That would be more accurate. But to claim there are only two and you know at birth is just ignorant.
You are going through ridiculous leaps and lengths to avoid the obvious simple solution that already exists today. And for what? A strange need for a document to be immutable? Perfection of historical information?
Those seem like tenuous reasons do something that actively takes options from people who value those options.
A strange need for a document to be immutable? Perfection of historical information?
Is it so strange that someone expects an official document about someone’s birth to accurately represent that birth?
But is that what we want? Fuck it, let’s change the past and pretend it’s something that’s a little more pleasant. It’s “for a good reason”. To make someone feel better. Get rid of anything that might cause discomfort while you’re at it. Let’s get rid of slavery - might make people feel uncomfortable. Seems you agree more with DeSantis’s fascist revisionism than you might initially expect.
People deserve to be treated with dignity and respect no matter who they are. But we cannot start playing make believe to protect feelings. A rock is a rock is a rock. If you were born a male then you were born a male end of story.
You can transition after, and people should show you respect and kindness. But forever and for the rest of history you would have been born a male.
It makes me feel so frustrated how this ideology has impregnated the left. We are losing the war against fascism and here we are focusing on absolute absurdities.
If you’re adopted, you can get your birth certificate amended to put the names of your adoptive parents on it. If you change your name, you can do the same. They’re exclusively singling out gender here.
You make a good point. We can change who we are but we can’t change who we were.
I can just see right wingers trying to make yet more laws to fuck over trans people tho saying they can only use their “assigned at birth certificate” or something.
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Except we all know this is not done in good faith to fix a real problem. Its real intent to further push a transphobic agenda and punish people who are trans.
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Would agree, except 99% of person identification, uses sex and specifically YOUR birth certificate. For current identification purposes for anything official.
Birth certificates are not used for any medical purpose. They are entirely for identification.
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I am middle aged and have never had to present my birth cert. Ever. I don’t think I even possess it.
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Of course I have. I can’t recall when I got my first license at 16 years old, but I certainly haven’t needed it since then. The most I’ve ever been asked for, including by employers, is my social security card
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I fail to see the major problem, then. It’s easily rectified by getting two other easily obtained id’s. You don’t even need a driver’s license, an identification card is basically the same process.
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“It doesn’t effect me, so it’s not a problem for anyone else.”
This is a bad take. This law’s intent is 100% to hurt trans people. Don’t go looking for reason and justifying it.
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However, because all other records take information from your birth certificate, this effectively bars trans people from having photo identification that aligns with their gender. This creates a safety issue for trans people every time they have to provide said photo identification.
Your birth certificate also records the name your parents gave you at birth, but we’ve allowed people to amend the document when they change their name for a long time. Why is this any different?
Safety issue? If someone is in danger from showing an ID they’re probably in danger already. Regular people wouldn’t care less.
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Plenty of folks don’t know. There are experts that are brought in to determine confusing cases, and they sometimes get it wrong. Be happy if your genitals just match one of the obvious binaries and you don’t have this issue. But many folks do.
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The purpose of the document is to record facts but you’re ok if those facts are wrong sometimes. That seems strange to me.
Why does the document event need a gender or sex? We’re recording that a person was born for proof of citizenship. Citizenship doesn’t require genitalia.
We’re recording for a number of reasons which includes birth of citizenship. There are important demographic reasons for why you need to know what % of your population is male versus female.
For example, policy in China where there are a larger ratio of males would need to be different than in Russia where there is a higher ratio of females.
I don’t really see the issue in all of this. A trans person should be treated as whatever gender they wanna be but they are born one sex or the other. We can’t pretend otherwise, makes no sense.
Sex. Isn’t. Binary. Intersex people exist. They exist. They are real.
I’d agree with you if there were three options: obviously male, obviously female, TBD. That would be more accurate. But to claim there are only two and you know at birth is just ignorant.
Ok then put TBD on ones you can’t tell at birth. Sure, that makes sense. There are exceptions to everything.
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Around 1in 1,000.
You are going through ridiculous leaps and lengths to avoid the obvious simple solution that already exists today. And for what? A strange need for a document to be immutable? Perfection of historical information?
Those seem like tenuous reasons do something that actively takes options from people who value those options.
Is it so strange that someone expects an official document about someone’s birth to accurately represent that birth?
But is that what we want? Fuck it, let’s change the past and pretend it’s something that’s a little more pleasant. It’s “for a good reason”. To make someone feel better. Get rid of anything that might cause discomfort while you’re at it. Let’s get rid of slavery - might make people feel uncomfortable. Seems you agree more with DeSantis’s fascist revisionism than you might initially expect.
People deserve to be treated with dignity and respect no matter who they are. But we cannot start playing make believe to protect feelings. A rock is a rock is a rock. If you were born a male then you were born a male end of story.
You can transition after, and people should show you respect and kindness. But forever and for the rest of history you would have been born a male.
It makes me feel so frustrated how this ideology has impregnated the left. We are losing the war against fascism and here we are focusing on absolute absurdities.
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If you’re adopted, you can get your birth certificate amended to put the names of your adoptive parents on it. If you change your name, you can do the same. They’re exclusively singling out gender here.
You make a good point. We can change who we are but we can’t change who we were.
I can just see right wingers trying to make yet more laws to fuck over trans people tho saying they can only use their “assigned at birth certificate” or something.
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It records your sex and that never changes with current technology.
We should change the field to gender if we want people to change it.
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